Dodgy US cars ...

[gcraill]

111 degrees and my AC compressor chokes and dies, dealer says 2-4 weeks to get a new one from the States, it's a Dodge - as in a "Dodgy Motor" and I think I shall not buy US again, you fellas need to seriously work on your quality ...

[jamief]

Re: Dodgy US cars ...

Thats why I only buy Toyota products....

[kitvb1]

Re: Dodgy US cars ...

* grabs popcorn - puts feet up *

[BenThurley]

Re: Dodgy US cars ...

Note to self: never let Jamie follow behind in his Toyota.

Q. What's the difference between driving a Toyota and playing golf?

A: When you play golf, it's usually a case of "Whack!!!......Oh $*1t!"
but when you drive a Toyota it's a case of "Oh Shiiii..........WHACK!"

[jtemple]

Re: Dodgy US cars ...

So, Greg. How old is your Dodge? Just curious.

[BenThurley]

Re: Dodgy US cars ...

Out of interest do the Americans watch top gear much? I know it is exported around the world and you get some BBC stuff over there. They're not usually that complimentary about American cars though. The usual thing is they handle poorly, are uneconomical and the build quality is poor. They do seem to like Fords though, in particular the focus, mondeo and GT.

Having watched a bit of pimp my ride, all the cars on that show look like would be MOT failures over here. Each year your car has to pass a safety test here to make sure things like tyres and brakes are up to scratch. I'm guessing from watching pimp my ride that there is no such test in the US so people aren't as bothered about road worthiness?

[MichaelCatalani]

Re: Dodgy US cars ...

Having watched a bit of pimp my ride, all the cars on that show look like would be MOT failures over here.

So, let me get this straight. You are guaging the quality of American made cars based upon the show "pimp my ride"?

For a fair comparison, why dont you list a good European built car, and put the price tag next to it, and an American failure, and put the price tag next to it.

For the record, I owned a Dodge Viper ACR, and it would eat alive anything that came out of Europe. It also cost a fraction of the Euro cars.

[Mercury]

Re: Dodgy US cars ...

It also cost a fraction of the Euro cars

A fraction ? Where did you see that ?

[MichaelCatalani]

Re: Dodgy US cars ...

A fraction ? Where did you see that ?

You show me a Euro car that could hang in my rear view mirror for more than a few seconds, and I'll show you a Euro car that cost 2-3 times as much as the Viper.

[BenThurley]

Re: Dodgy US cars ...

lol you can always count on the same individuals to overreact.

No I wasn't using pimp my ride to judge the quality. If you read my post then you'll see that I was trying to figure out whether there is such a thing as an MOT in the US. This is basically a roadworthy test that each car must pass on an annual basis. We don't have a choice about this test in the UK so people are very concious about quality. I was wondering that if such a test didn't exist then perhaps we wouldn't be so bothered about build quality?

Taking the price challenge you've not picked the best example. A dodge viper new in 2007 in the UK would have been about £70,000, that's expensive! I just keyed it into the parkers car review site which has a section called "Also consider" for each car. Against the Dodge it suggests a Noble M12 at between £51000 and £57000 or a Porsche 911 from £70000 and £110000. It's a bit of a silly comparison though because there are loads of alternatives for expensive sports cars. Generally the US ones have bigger engines and the Europeans have better handling.

I would have thought you would compare something like a Chrysler 300C (£24000 29000) with a BMW 5 series (£28000 £52000). Again it's a bit of a silly comparison because the BMW is a much better car but it shows the price difference you talk about.

[BenThurley]

Re: Dodgy US cars ...

If you want to look at sports car comparisons to see who makes the fastest cars then check out the top gear power laps board.

All different prices but can you see a trend?

Car used Time (mins)
Gumpert Apollo 1.17.1
Ascari A10 1.17.3
Koenigsegg CCX (with Top Gear spoiler) 1.17.6
Noble M600 1.17.7
Pagani Zonda F Roadster 1.17.7
Caterham R500 1.17.9
Bugatti Veyron 1.18.3
Pagani Zonda F 1.18.4
Maserati MC12 1.18.9
Ferrari Enzo 1.19.0
Lamborghini LP670 SV 1.19.0
Ariel Atom 1.19.5
Lamborghini LP560 1.19.5
Ferrari Scuderia 1.19.7
Nissan GT-R 1.19.7
Lamborghini LP640 1.19.8
Porsche Carerra GT 1.19.8
Koenigsegg CCX 1.20.4
Corvette ZR1 1.20.4

The dodge viper is much cheaper than these but has this time:

Dodge Viper SRT-10 1.28.5

That's 73rd in the list and comes below all of the following times:

Mitsubishi Evo X 1.28.22
Subaru WRX Sti 1.28.2
BMW X5M 1.28.2
Renault Megane R26R 1.28.1
BMW Z4 1.28.2
Porsche 911 GT3 1.27.2
TVR 350C 1.27.5
Nissan 370Z 1.27.5
BMW M3 CSL 1.28.0
Lotus Exige 1.26.4

Some of those are family saloons...

[jtemple]

Re: Dodgy US cars ...

Ben, yes we do have inspections. Here in Missouri your car has to pass a safety inspection which includes tires, brakes, lights, windshield wipers, etc. AND depending on where in Missouri it also has to pass an emissions inspection. And the system is set up that you can't renew license plates without the inspection.

For the record, I've owned quite a mix of cars. Chevy, Ford, VW, Saab, Toyota, Kia. Chevy products are OK but I've had some bad experiences with their products. But to be fair, I haven't owned a GM car in quite some time. My bad experiences were in the 80s (of course, most US comapnies were making bad cars in the 80s). I had a new beetle (2000 model) which did have some issues but overall OK. I currently own a Kia which I'm pleased with so far. I also have Ford and Toyota and from my experience I've had the best luck with those two brands.

I also mentioned the Saab, which I no longer own. A 1998 900 convertible. Really loved that car. And this is where people in the US tend to shy away from foreign cars. The parts for my Saab was 2-3 times the cost for a comparable part in a US made car. I'm assuming US parts are more expensive Europe than their European counterparts. GM/Ford/Chrysler may have their share of problems but it's far cheaper to fix a US made car here rather than a non-US made car. Of course that doesn't excuse quality but when you talk about the total ownership cost over the lifetime of a car that can make a difference. Not to mention the availability of a qualified mechanic for foreign cars.

[BenThurley]

Re: Dodgy US cars ...

That test sounds fairy similar to the one over here. How are those kids still driving those cars on pimp my ride?!?! They must be breaking some kind of law!

It's funny that the parts for a Saab 900 would be so dear. At the time they were owned by GM and the 900 is basically what we call a Vauxhall Vectra, Opel to the rest of the world. You're right though, Japanese parts tend to be quite expensive here.

[jtemple]

Re: Dodgy US cars ...

I'm just guessing but I believe some states have exclusions on certain types of cars. I do know that if you register a car as an "antique" in Missouri you're exempt from any safety or emissions inspections. However, you are only allowed to put so many miles on the car per year. If you go over that amount your antique status is revoked and you have to begin normal inspections. I "think" there might also be exemptions for cars classified as "show" cars.

And yes, I puzzled over the cost of Saab parts as well since they were owned by Government Motors...oops..I meant General Motors.

[MichaelCatalani]

Re: Dodgy US cars ...

If you want to look at sports car comparisons to see who makes the fastest cars then check out the top gear power laps board.

All different prices but can you see a trend?


The dodge viper is much cheaper than these but has this time:


That's 73rd in the list and comes below all of the following times:


Some of those are family saloons...

Nice list. It's BS.

My viper personally ate alive 2 different models of the Lamborghini, including a brand spanking new mecielagao and a contauch that was owned by the CEO of one of my clients, much to his shigrin. My partner had a Corvette ZR1. He would be first to tell you it wasnt close to the power of the Viper. (Although the Corvette was a hell of a deal for what it was.) The Lambos at least could hang.

Porsche? Hahahahahahaha. Nice try. They look real funny disappearing in the rear view mirror.

It you are squawking at the price of a viper, you havent priced out the cars on that list. Get ready to squeal like a little school girl.

Oh, and see how good those cars run when they have to be outfitted for California emmissions.